Suspension lift for K30

[Bulldog]

OK, I bought the BDS 4" lift for my 1987 1/2 ton truck, now I'm looking for a lift for my 1985 1 ton. Actually it's a 5/4 ton CUCV, which I think is just a K30 with an extra spring in the rear pack. This will be my work / trail rig, very utilitarian. I want to keep the rear springs for heavy loads and heavy tongue weight when towing. This truck is also a diesel, so it will need heavy duty front springs.

I would like to go with a 5.5" or 6" lift to clear 35" - 37" tires, but steering correction on the Dana 60 looks expensive. Some say 6" or more lift on them pretty much requires cross over steering. I may have to just go with 4" and limit myself to 35's with minor trimming.

BDS does not offer a kit for the 1 ton. Cherokee at The Performance Shop said the 3/4 ton springs would work and I'd just need to piece together u-bolts and steering correction for the Dana 60. Not sure if I want to go this way.

Superlift offers 3.5" and 5.5" kits with heavy front springs and rear blocks. The 3.5" kit comes with a 3" steering block and the 5.5" kit comes with a 4" drop drag link. The only bad thing about the 5.5" kit is the footnotes say "1977½-91 models require clearancing (machining) of the front driveshaft CV cluster to prevent binding. If vehicle has single exhaust, the cross-over pipe requires modification to clear front driveshaft." 4Wheel Parts website also says "w/o Autotrac; Requires Dual Cardan Driveshaft If 4WD Used Over 35 MPH". Right now I can't spend too much money and new drivelines would put this hold for a while.

I'm also not too keen on rear blocks. I've been looking at Off Road Designs shackle reverse kits which would give me 4" of lift. Combined with their 6" Super Shackles, it would give me another 1.5" of rear lift. So either of these options would go well with Superlifts front springs, eliminating the rear blocks.

Off Road Designs sells Tuff County front springs. The 4" springs have a 495# spring rate and the 6" springs are 465#. I don't know if either of these are heavy enough for the diesel engine. The lady at Off Road Designs "thinks" these are heavy enough, but I want to be sure. I can't find any spring rate data of Superlifts to compare with.

So I guess I'm asking if 5.5" or 6" lift with the Dana 60 requires extensive driveline work or expensive steering correction. Also, would the Tuff Country springs be heavy enought for the diesel?

[sevenslats]

Clearancing a CV isn't a big deal, from what I've read.
Is the shackle flip and extended shackles together enough lift for the rear? That'd let you keep your 5/4 ton rating back there.

[Bulldog]

Yes, shackle flip and extended shackles nets 5.5" of rear lift. Shackle flip alone is 4" of lift.

I was worried about the dual cardan driveshaft over 35 MPH. I tow my Bobcat in the winter and use 4WD on the roads.

[Bulldog]

BTW, I know this setup isn't going to offer the greatest articulation. I am going to get sway bar disconnects to help a little. If I go with the longer rear shackles, this will also help a little.

[AKMark]

You should get more than 4" of lift with the shackle flip. Measure the current shackle eye to eye and multiply by two, you should get between 5 and 6 inches of lift. Kev put a homemade shackle flip on his 74 if you'd like to see what it did for him. Ryan (AK20) put the ORD system in his rig as well if you'd rather check that one out.

The 6.2L Diesel only weighs 700 lbs, more, but not tons more than a small block and much lighter than a big block. When I swapped a 350 for a 6.2 in my 85 Burb, I didn't change the springs and the ride height stayed the same. The 91 Burb uses the exact same spring pack from the factory the 85 did and it had a 6.2L stock. You don't need bigger springs up front.

I'd look at Kev's setup on his 74, as it runs 35's and is essentially similar to what you want to run. If you are gonna pull, stick to 35's or smaller. Less tire float while towing that way.

[Bulldog]

You should get more than 4" of lift with the shackle flip. Measure the current shackle eye to eye and multiply by two, you should get between 5 and 6 inches of lift.

I haven't really looked at the geometry myself, but this is what I read from ORD's website:

"You may wonder why we don't have a Shackle Flip kit for more than 4" of lift. The reason is that to gain more lift, the end of the spring has to drop down twice the desired lift amount. In other words to gain 1 extra inch, we would have to drop the rear of the spring a full 2 inches. This drop at the tail of the spring can become a ground clearance problem and promotes roll-oversteer which is a handling problem in which the rear of the truck startsto feel "loose" under hard cornering with body roll. We've chosen the 4" lift height as the limit for these reasons"

They seem to say everything will be alright with the 6" HD shackles combined with the shackle flip. This would give me 5.5" of rear lift.

[ChevyKev]

I'm also not too keen on rear blocks.

Neithewr am I - the shackle flip is the way to go. Either ORD or your own - and there are a few ways to do that.

So I guess I'm asking if 5.5" or 6" lift with the Dana 60 requires extensive driveline work or expensive steering correction.

Anytime you put 5-6" lift on something it will need driveshaft work. There just normally isn't 10" of travel in a drive shaft (6 that you dropped, and 4 to engage splines = 10.)

Also, would the Tuff Country springs be heavy enought for the diesel?

See what Mark said about spring rates and such. Though I doubt those spring rates would equal a 5/4 ton spring rate, it would probably do ok.

I was worried about the dual cardan driveshaft over 35 MPH. I tow my Bobcat in the winter and use 4WD on the roads.

Do you not already have a dual cardigan in there? Most stock Chevies do. 2 u-joint in the rear, 1 in the front. I have 6" lift on my blazer and that driveshaft, without clearancing, and a Dana 60 front does fine. Granted, I had to get the proper length shaft after the lift, but since then it's been fine.

[Bulldog]

Do you not already have a dual cardigan in there? Most stock Chevies do. 2 u-joint in the rear, 1 in the front. I have 6" lift on my blazer and that driveshaft, without clearancing, and a Dana 60 front does fine. Granted, I had to get the proper length shaft after the lift, but since then it's been fine.

Yep, Google is my friend. I understand the terminology now. I was thinking multiple cardan, like CV joints on both ends of the shaft.

Can the clearancing be done by at home or should a machine shop do it? I imagine a grinder or carbide burr would do the job, but then do you have to worry about balancing?

Would a transfer case drop work well enough with a 5.5" lift not to have to lengthen the shafts?

[TJVigilante]

I don't think with the heat we're getting that he'd want a single cardigan, much less a double, Kev.

[akram]

Use a grinder. It's not hard and I'm sure you are competent enough to not grind through it.
Here is a link for it http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/cvmod/ It is on a toyota ifs cv shaft that was turned into a ds. A cv is the same regardless of where it's at.

[Bulldog]

Cool, thanks for the link to the article. Looks like no problem at all. More uses for the ball joint / u-joint press I bought

Probably also go with a transfer case drop also.

Monday morning I'm going to call ORD and order the shackle flip kit, 6" super shackles, sway bar disconnects, and extended brake lines. I was thinking of ordering their bumpstops. I don't see any pictures of them on their website. Do you think they're worth $65 a pair or should I just make my own?

Will order the 5.5" Superlift kit for the front springs, u-bolt kit, shocks, and 4" drop drag link. I'll ditch the 5" rear blocks and u-bolts since I'm running the shackle flip kit.

I'll measure the drivelines after install at full droop and check to see if I need them lengthened. I think Young's said it was like $300 per driveline to lengthen them.

Thanks for everyone's input.

[ChevyKev]

Probably also go with a transfer case drop also.

Yes - this will help. Although I wouldn't drop it more than 2 inches - probably 1.5 would be ideal and can be done fairly easily. I have an idea for making something like this - we should get together and talk.

Monday morning I'm going to call ORD and order the shackle flip kit, 6" super shackles, sway bar disconnects, and extended brake lines. I was thinking of ordering their bumpstops. I don't see any pictures of them on their website. Do you think they're worth $65 a pair or should I just make my own?

Make your own bumpstops. Also, I have a set of ORD sway bar disconnects I'll sell for 1/2 the price of new.

I'll measure the drivelines after install at full droop and check to see if I need them lengthened. I think Young's said it was like $300 per driveline to lengthen them.

yes, unfortunately Young's has the only balancer in town so they can charge whatever they want. Literally the price for their driveshaft work is more than twice what shops in MO charged me. :mad: but hey, at least I'm not in MO anymore!

[Bulldog]

Yes - this will help. Although I wouldn't drop it more than 2 inches - probably 1.5 would be ideal and can be done fairly easily. I have an idea for making something like this - we should get together and talk.

Sounds good. I've heard of using washers or cut pieces of pipe with longer bolts. Something more substantial would be better. I'll get with you in a couple weeks when I get home

Make your own bumpstops. Also, I have a set of ORD sway bar disconnects I'll sell for 1/2 the price of new.

Do the discos not work that well?

[AKMark]

If I could interject, for just a few bucks more than Youngs or sometimes cheaper than them, you could get a Tom Woods driveshaft, those are far better than any crap Youngs will make for you. Also, if you research Youngs, they've messed up many driveshafts for folks. Even if it was $50 more per shaft, I'd order Tom Woods instead.

[ChevyKev]

Sounds good. I've heard of using washers or cut pieces of pipe with longer bolts. Something more substantial would be better. I'll get with you in a couple weeks when I get home

I've done the washers, or the spacers and longer bolts (the ones from the removal of a steering box work ok and are strong) But I've always thought something more sturdy was in order. I'll work on what I have in mind for my rig and be able to show you when you get back. Aha! an excuse to work on my own stuff! :yes:

Do the discos not work that well?

They work just fiine except when you go to crossover steering (as I did a few years ago) the stock sway bar interferes with the new steering so is obsolete.

Ditto what Mark said about Tom Woods ... or who was it

- Jesse at High Angle Driveline actually gave away one of his to someone on our site a few years back. It was basically just to advertise, but he did give it away including shipping it up here and has worked well with several of us on the board ever since!

[Bulldog]

I'll get with you on the transfer case drop when I get home. Same with the discos.

I am going to call Superlift directly here in a minute. Their webpage says 5.5" only need the 4" drop draglink for steering correction, while ORD says I'll want crossover for anything over 4". I'm sure crossover is much better, but just can't afford it right now. Hoping I can get by with the drop draglink for now and upgrade later.

I'm pretty set on getting 6" of lift and would hate to have to settle for 4". Right now I'm almost thinking on waiting and saving some money to go 6" with crossover later. Then just put 285/75R16 on the truck for now. Not ideal from wheeling right now, but would get me on the trail until I got exactly what I want.

[sevenslats]

Do it right the first time. Once you know the facts.

JMHO.

[Bulldog]

Well, I ordered my 5.5" Superlift from 4WheelParts. Their website showed free shipping with no disclaimers for Alaska. We'll see if I get a call from them saying they can't ship for free to Alaska. If they won't ship for free, I'll cancel the order with them. BTW, ORD wanted $262 ground shipping to drop ship front springs and shocks from Tuff Country.

I'm going to order the 4" shackle flip and 6" super shackles from ORD to eliminate the rear lift blocks.

I'll see how the tires fit with this lift. I may think about the zero rate 1" offset to move the front axle forward to clear the tires better without trimming. Then I'll definately need a new front driveline.

[sevenslats]

Well, I ordered my 5.5" Superlift from 4WheelParts. Their website showed free shipping with no disclaimers for Alaska. We'll see if I get a call from them saying they can't ship for free to Alaska. If they won't ship for free, I'll cancel the order with them...

You'll get a call. or an email.
Good luck.

[AKMark]

Hope that shipping works, but I agree with Geoff.

[ChevyKev]

I am going to call Superlift directly here in a minute. Their webpage says 5.5" only need the 4" drop draglink for steering correction, while ORD says I'll want crossover for anything over 4". I'm sure crossover is much better, but just can't afford it right now. Hoping I can get by with the drop draglink for now and upgrade later.

Most steering correction arms that I have seen are labeled 4-6 inch lift. Reason being, you can add 2" lift springs and use your stock stuff - just lengthe by unscrewing tie rods a bit. So if the stock will work with 2" + the 4" correction arm = 6 inch lift is ok. I ran this and did just fine. The reason I went to crossover was treying to turn the 39.5x16 TSL's was difficult on the steering system. Crossover allows better geometry of the steering parts and thus is easier on the steering system (but more difficult on the frame - so get the frame strengtheners when you eventually go to the crossover system.)

ORD says to get the crossover because... they want to sell their stuff! Now, I do agree that the crossover is better, just not absolutely necessary. I wheeled the Blazer for 2 years with the steering correction arm and other than stressing the PS system, it was fine.

If they cancel your order due to shipping, let me know before you re-order because I want to make a shackle flip kit as well.

[Bulldog]

You'll get a call. or an email.
Good luck.

Hope that shipping works, but I agree with Geoff.

I see they've only charged my credit card for the lift amount only. I haven't got shipping confirmation yet. I'm going to call them in the morning to try get a tracking number.

If they cancel your order due to shipping, let me know before you re-order because I want to make a shackle flip kit as well.

I haven't placed the ORD order yet because I wanted to make sure the 4WheelParts order was shipped first, otherwise there was stuff I needed to order from ORD. I'll probably order tomorrow. PM me with you phone number and what'd you like to order. I was almost thinking of ordering an extra set of shackle flip, you never know what'd I'd need it on

[sevenslats]

:keepingmyfingerscrossedbecauseiamstillaskeptic:

[TJVigilante]

If it works out I know where I'm doing my shopping from now on.

[78calico]

I just shipped off my D44 knuckle to ORD yesterday. It should be on it's way back, along with a pitman arm, in about a week and a half so if anyone wants to add on to the order to save on shipping let me know soon.

[ChevyKev]

I haven't placed the ORD order yet because I wanted to make sure the 4WheelParts order was shipped first, otherwise there was stuff I needed to order from ORD. I'll probably order tomorrow. PM me with you phone number and what'd you like to order. I was almost thinking of ordering an extra set of shackle flip, you never know what'd I'd need it on

not exactly what I meant... although it kinda sounds like that:

If they cancel your order due to shipping, let me know before you re-order because I want to make a shackle flip kit as well.

"I want to make a shackle flip" in other words, I want to design and produce something similar, so if you don't mind being a sort of test vehicle...